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DavidTwo

An opinion piece on phases/guilds and exclusive RP

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I've been involved with these types of communities for 10+ years now, and I've noticed some things. Especially when it comes to phases that host publically.

 

Heck, I'm guilty of this too, as my own guild and phase at the time turned into clique-based RP with only one group RPing and no one else involved. Knowing what I did to others made me sick in the end when I've heard about it. And I really just right this because I care. I don't want this to happen to other guilds and phases.

 

What I write about is this: RP that turns into exclusivity and involves only a certain group of people that no one else has the option of joining... while a public roleplaying phase is hosting.

 

Why am I writing this thread today, you might ask? Slightly out of irritation, but mostly because I don't want what killed my guild(s)/phase(s) happening to anyone elses guild/phase. That, and RP for public areas should never turn into exclusivity. If you're hosting a public phase.. and yes as I said, I myself am guilty of this too, make the story at least open to people joining. Or at least let people observe if it's something you do not wish people to intrude upon. Or discuss upon it IC in the phase/RP wherever to keep people informed and/or keep people entertained.

 

Roleplays that turn into exclusivity can kill a guild and a phase. I've both felt it happen and seen it happen upon my many years on Divinity/RPH/Epsi and I dislike every time it happens. We're a small server. I get that private RP will end up happening regardless.

 

But together, I feel like we can make a difference and keep both people entertained and wanting roleplay in phases.. and also keep our lovely safe haven of a role playing server active :)

 

**Note to mods. Didn't know where to post this. Apologies if this is in the wrong spot! :)**

Edited by DavidTwo

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I am not quite sure what's implied with this post, is this particularly aimed at publicly hosted phases who later on turn a little more exclusive?

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Correct. Or more, guild/guilds that may end up hosting said phase and later on the phase just dies from a lack of RP but the guildies themselves still end up RPing exclusively or w/e.

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oh boy you just made me revive my inactive forum account for this (full disclosure: valo'sen, wanted epsilon criminal and mastermind hamster enthusiast here)

lemme hit you with a hot fact: phases are never public friendly, for a few reasons.

firstly, people who make the phase are of course going to make it cater to their needs first and foremost. public roleplay is no exception. you don't just make a phase only to realize "oh man, i get nothing out of this for myself or my friends". it's not a crime or a sin to be self-interested when making something, which even if others outside your social bubble join, is for you

secondly, public phases have a bell curve, with an acute correlation between amount of people / quality of rp. no people = no rp, handful of people = good rp, lots of people = clusterfuck. its alright managing half a dozen people at once (6 for those of you who aren't bakers), but the more people you add in a singular area, the more likely chaos will erupt as people clash individually with each other over misunderstandings or outright belligerence to one-another. of course you can get some friends to help dm, but of course they want to rp too, as do you. so lo and behold, generally there's nobody managing anyone, and if you've got a linear-ish story in mind to tell then have fun with that flying out the window when X, Y or Z walk into your phase and for whatever reason things go sideways.

third: yeah public phases always have that clique. hell, it might not even be the people running the phase, but yes more likely than not a general atmosphere of "us vs them" manifests between those who are in and those who are out. so you're not wrong on that front.

 

not gonna lie, we've had this talk before, to a certain extent. no specific details, but i'm sure you've been very much aware that this exclusivity thing isn't new and has been happening for a while. although i will say, you're not the only one guilty of it. hell, point at any public phase ever, see there's a guild for it, understand that there's a clique, know for a fact that it's a system where you're either a part of the clique and benefit from it, or aren't and are simply a "guest in someone elses house", so to speak.

i could go on and on, going from point to point, but seeing as im just typing this up real quick i'll just finish by saying: it's not a crime to just have a phase to have fun with friends in, slowly trickling in new members through acquaintance, instead of opening a phase to the public and praying you get some good 'catches' that stay.

 

i'll add more if you're interested in asking questions / continuing the discussion, but please remember i am special and am not necessarily intelligent nor sentient enough to give truly knowledgeable advice.

 

also i'm not roleplaying so i refuse to use proper grammar

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Being amongst these servers, I do agree that public phases are a bit of a gamble. Because you don't know who you might get.. if they'll be toxic, good at RP, etc.

 

I made this thread mostly with the intention of trying to stir conversation. To see if we as a community can fix the ways that we've had for.. probably a long time. And I figured I probably wasn't the only one guilty of it. 'Tis why I had started this thread. :P

 

To start a conversation. To see if we can fix a problem and get people RPing again. And.. back to the gamble thing. That's a risk public phases usually have to take. But people want RP. And that's usually one way to attract RP.

 

But when cliques/guilds go off to do RP while let's say still hosting the phase (which again, all hands on deck. I'm guilty of as well), then where's the roleplay for everyone that ends up joining the phase? If they see people RPing elsewhere in the phase, they may get slapped for trying to join it. So.. they just leave. Go to start, and complain about a lack of roleplay.

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i think the last point you make there is something moreso to do with roleplay itself rather than specifically niches: its hard to just walk up to two people in the midst of roleplay already, attempting to join them unless you already know them. quite the parallel with irl, no?

icebreaking is quite important when entering a phase, i'll agree, but generally you need (imo) to designate someone to help newcomers 'settle in'. by doing so you help them engage with the phase, while simultaneously connecting them into the current group and establish a more open environment for players where they can now feel comfortable entering and engaging in rp on their own.

that, in my mind at least, may be a good way to get new blood in? transforms niches into groups, allows for actual event planning with large rosters, etc etc. finding someone willing to be that icebreaker will be the challenge, imo

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The common scenario I found is that someone tried to join IC, the characters react to it IC, said person attempting to join then takes it personally OOC and storms off. People just see chances to be a part of something, but then bail out the moment someone else or group of people seem a little off-put at first. The chance always remains, they just think they're being turned away OOC.

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Honestly this exact instance is why I stopped RPing on Epsilon entirely. Why would I waste time trying to get into roleplay on a server that doesn't cater to it? Not going to name any phases specifically as it's common fact they all happen to just be that, but every time I have came back it's always the same deal. New phases 'everyone' in quotations is apart of until you realize it's usually the phase owner and their select groupies that tend to hover around. Or in some shy cases I've seen that the owner themselves is trying to be inclusive to every individual involved, but usually gets weighed down by another group that is acting in place of the phase's 'clique'. I can name a few groups of people who tend to do that. 

Regardless, it's why I left, and I can safely assume others did or will if it doesn't change. Why push against a clique that doesn't want outside RP in a 'public' phase when you can go to other MMOs, discord servers or where-ever else you get roleplay? I speak this not as a 'lmao get fucked' moment but rather a way of stating the issue. 

However I can't really say exactly what would be good to fix this. Perhaps the simplest answer is just trying to make a phase 'non-clique friendly', whatever that would mean. I'm sure though regardless, if the pompous attitude of groups of rpers who sit on high horses were disallowed to really act that way would probably make a better state for the server. Less toxicity stemming from a few individuals who hold grudges, blacklist RPers over their writing styles or concepts, or just overall stuck up natures where its always a 'im better than you', it'd do the server a LOT of justice. 

(I know I am suspect of making fun of people and holding grudges in the past, but I've changed guys I swear I'll even write a poem). 

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5 hours ago, Myomeme said:

Or in some shy cases I've seen that the owner themselves is trying to be inclusive to every individual involved, but usually gets weighed down by another group that is acting in place of the phase's 'clique'. 

I thought I was alone in having that sentiment, good to know (I guess) it's not just me. I often feel that way as a guild/phase owner.

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Yeah that one I've seen happen too. Heck whenever I host/hosted, I was trying to remain at the gate of the town I host, RP with whoever enters and just kinda stay there telling stories IC or w/e or go to the tavern.

 

But I've been pulled away so many times too that it turned into what I'm trying to solve here. I'm def guilty of it and again I feel bad over it all haha.

 

 

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I do think that, to a certain extent, a well-built phase has a core 'home team' audience that it appeals to--some community or Discord, the 'clique' as some call it. I do like Valo's way of describing the situation: you are a guest in someone else's house. Completely come-as-you-go, free-for-all public phase RP has very little you could possibly do if it's not a campaign. You've brought a character to someone else's phase, and it is essentially an opportunity for both parties to get to know each other and see if they want to permanently join.

I don't find it strange at all to host 'private RP' in what is otherwise a public phase, for when quality control is important. I feel like a true private phase is a phase that was entirely built for a predetermined group of friends, with maybe a friend-of-a-friend sometimes joining. Whereas public phase RP would be the idea that anyone can come in and check it out and maybe join the phase. But having a truly 'public' phase is next to impossible to manage without dedicated DMs managing the situation, and really that's not very fun.

It seems like an OK situation. So long as phases accept public people--either by just joining and checking it out on the surface, or through advertisements--the situation seems pretty acceptable. What's important, I feel, is that a person doesn't come online and ask 'where do I go for RP?' and can't get an answer. At least surface-level RP where they can probe whether they wish to make a certain phase their home, rather than just sit in start all day talking with people until someone thinks they're cool and invites them to their clique.


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Some will accept public people. Some phases do. Others that may host as a 'public phase' and is a guild phase may end up having more... guildies than others however.

 

It's not a bad thing, but let's say I enter a public phase expecting RP. Instead I enter to a barren phase.. only for let's say all of the guildies to be congregating elsewhere in said phase. That's where my argument had been as well. And why I was discussing the whole 'exclusive RP' bit.

 

Iunno maybe I'm just a crazy man, haha.

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Something to merit Azarch's words. While it is okay for the people who build/created the phases entire idea to be a few friends. It is advisable that anyone who plans on hosting a public phase be sure to contribute to the spread of RP on the server. Not simply posting the ad for the phase for people to join and then immediately going off elsewhere with friends or guildies to do whatever it is they want.

A great public phase tactic, I feel. Would be to invite others, whether through IC dialogue or a chain of events happening in the phase that could be presented through phase announce or other mediums. Something that would spark other characters to react and perhaps even check out what's happening. David's last post is a problem I've seen too many times. Where I've entered a phase, expecting others to be there, but left with a really, beautifully built phase. But the people who host it are often elsewhere with the group they choose to be with, without any visual queues of what's going on or even where they might be. While I get that can be sometimes hard, given the nature of some phases or activities within them. It is always a good idea to levy your options.

Do you want to host a phase to the public so that you can gather more for the phases' story, or do you want a more open ended place where ideas from all different types of people can be explored. Where a single factor could possibly change the outcome of what direction you're going in your phase. It's a tactic I employ in my time volunteering for tabletop RPGs at my local library. I don't /always/ have a group of set people, and I don't /always/ have something in my head that will go one way. Every new face is a welcomed addition to what could be the story.

Edited by Rosaleaf

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