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Avalia

What Makes a Good Roleplay Server: Learning From the Rest

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<3 thank you for putting me in this.

 

Few things that I can say really add to roleplaying quality in general is an appreciation and respect for other people, not just the characters, but of the roleplayers behind them. I don't want to log on to a server if I don't feel appreciated, or even respected. Nor do I want to roleplay with people that don't respect me. If someone is going to respect me, talk to me, have fun with me, there's no reason for me to not trust them. I can go lengths IC and OOC with them, I can have them do things to my characters because I trust it will lead to something good. That doesn't happen unless you are nice. So again -- having fun, and being nice just like Avalia said, is very important to me.

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The only problem with your first point is that (as anyone from Divinity can tell you) the constant "web" of RP can easily devolve into utter nonsense very quickly. With so many different characters and ideas often OOCly forced to be on amiable terms for some reason, the quality of the role play kind of goes down the drain. The immersion becomes quickly lost. We simply can't be blind and expect everyone to adhere to WoW's canon and role play with tension and rivalries in mind. Plus, this sort of atmosphere can become out of hand also in the respect that the stories/outgoing characters tend to become too "massive" for their own good. There's no ending point, no "chapter" system, so things just sort of grow into ridiculousness imo. 

 

Also, this sort of environment all too easily counters your point of RPing a diverse set of characters/ideas. When a community is so weaved together, people tend to stick to one character - maybe two - to avoid falling into irrelevance. They will stick to this one concept so long that said character becomes sort of dull in the respect that it is often hurled into situations where it makes no sense, gains "progression" that makes little sense, and generally loses a lot of the edge said character once had. 

 

Just my hindsight from Divinity, and I expect this community will be similar. So while these goals are noble, I'd say we also should proceed with caution. 

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7 minutes ago, Romeo said:

<3 thank you for putting me in this.

 

Few things that I can say really add to roleplaying quality in general is an appreciation and respect for other people, not just the characters, but of the roleplayers behind them. I don't want to log on to a server if I don't feel appreciated, or even respected. Nor do I want to roleplay with people that don't respect me. If someone is going to respect me, talk to me, have fun with me, there's no reason for me to not trust them. I can go lengths IC and OOC with them, I can have them do things to my characters because I trust it will lead to something good. That doesn't happen unless you are nice. So again -- having fun, and being nice just like Avalia said, is very important to me.

how could i not put u in this? <3

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1 minute ago, Finny said:

The only problem with your first point is that (as anyone from Divinity can tell you) the constant "web" of RP can easily devolve into utter nonsense very quickly. With so many different characters and ideas often OOCly forced to be on amiable terms for some reason, the quality of the role play kind of goes down the drain. The immersion becomes quickly lost. We simply can't be blind and expect everyone to adhere to WoW's canon and role play with tension and rivalries in mind. Plus, this sort of atmosphere can become out of hand also in the respect that the stories/outgoing characters tend to become too "massive" for their own good. There's no ending point, no "chapter" system, so things just sort of grow into ridiculousness imo. 

 

Also, this sort of environment all too easily counters your point of RPing a diverse set of characters/ideas. When a community is so weaved together, people tend to stick to one character - maybe two - to avoid falling into irrelevance. They will stick to this one concept so long that said character becomes sort of dull in the respect that it is often hurled into situations where it makes no sense, gains "progression" that makes little sense, and generally loses a lot of the edge said character once had. 

 

Just my hindsight from Divinity, and I expect this community will be similar. So while these goals are noble, I'd say we also should proceed with caution. 

I wouldn't force anyone to be amiable with each other IC, that's nonsense. All roleplay is good roleplay, and that includes IC animosity and conflict. I don't mean some united front against a common evil, just roleplay storylines that involve larger portions of the community; naturally occurring stuff that will inevitably generate connections and rivalries and ambitions.

I'm not of the mindset that stories really have to have an 'ending' point, or any sort of set series of events; most of what I roleplay tends to be very spontaneous and organic. Sure, you may kill the big bad guy at the end or whatever, but that doesn't mean the story is 'over'. One thing always leads to another, and this is not necessarily a negative thing.

As for your point about people sticking to one character, that is usually a problem of story focus. It is very easy to play other characters without someone 'falling into irrelevance'. 'Relevance' is just a perception, anyways. You are as relevant as you think you are.

I do enjoy feedback from Divinity players though, I never had the opportunity to play on the server.

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1. Larger, common roleplay storylines that most of the community participates in.

The problem with this springs up in a few ways. Firstly is the characters who are kings/queens of suddenly neutral kingdoms, lovers of x character from lore, etc. The characters that raise your eyebrow and make you think. Do you try to shrug it off or do you set your foot down? Common roleplay with the majority of the community can run into bumps with that. Another way is the OOC heads butting over head canons, how someone roleplays, etc. There are people who believe you shouldn't ever roleplay a powerful character. Do you tell them to STFU or do you cater to them? One other way is the phased set-up of the server - it may make it harder to run storylines.

 

2. An open, welcoming, friendly vibe

Trust me, I'm all for this. However, not everyone is. What happens if you're too late to be welcoming to someone? What if they're chased off by the shitposters, the toxic "REEEE UR HEADCANON IS AUTISTIC" players, etc. Do you ignore the problematic people and tell the people to do the same? Giving off a friendly vibe isn't always going to work when we have specific people here being outright assholes.

 

I have nothing to say about #3, I agree entirely.

 

Now #4 is one I'm heavily passionate for. However, there remains one issue I touched on above: The shitheads that barely skirt following the rules. They make new ideas hard to go for. Because they want to suck the fun out of everything that isn't their take on Warcraft.

 

Overall, I'm going to end this on: I agree, but achieving any of this/doing any of this has some hurdles in front of it.


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1 hour ago, Mithaniel said:

The problem with this springs up in a few ways. Firstly is the characters who are kings/queens of suddenly neutral kingdoms, lovers of x character from lore, etc. The characters that raise your eyebrow and make you think. Do you try to shrug it off or do you set your foot down? Common roleplay with the majority of the community can run into bumps with that. Another way is the OOC heads butting over head canons, how someone roleplays, etc. There are people who believe you shouldn't ever roleplay a powerful character. Do you tell them to STFU or do you cater to them? One other way is the phased set-up of the server - it may make it harder to run storylines.

When I talk about larger roleplay in which a good fraction of the server is involved in, I am not suddenly negating the eternal rule of "don't roleplay with people you don't want to roleplay with". If you don't want to interact with kings and queens, lore characters or whatever, don't. Those kinds of people are people who aren't really concerned with being apart of the community / WoW canon anyways (which is fine), and are really more concerned with making their own personal universe. My thread is not really directed at those kinds of people.

You don't have to cater to anyone. First and foremost, you roleplay what you believe to be the most interesting, most fun, and most compelling character concept, regardless of what others say. Surround yourself with people who enjoy your creativity, and you will find yourself gradually connected to the wider roleplay community. Ultimately the kind of people who say you shouldn't roleplay something 'powerful' are just telling you what they want, and not what you do.

 

1 hour ago, Mithaniel said:

Trust me, I'm all for this. However, not everyone is. What happens if you're too late to be welcoming to someone? What if they're chased off by the shitposters, the toxic "REEEE UR HEADCANON IS AUTISTIC" players, etc. Do you ignore the problematic people and tell the people to do the same? Giving off a friendly vibe isn't always going to work when we have specific people here being outright assholes.

I'm not telling you to be nice to toxic people, or tolerate them - it is usually best to ignore them, yes, but sometimes we can't help ourselves. The point I was making when I said that is that toxicity has a habit of spreading if it's the loudest voice in a given group or community. It affects the atmosphere. The best way to counter it is just to be nice, calm, level-headed, and reasonable. (Something I should work on sometimes as well!)

 

1 hour ago, Mithaniel said:

Now #4 is one I'm heavily passionate for. However, there remains one issue I touched on above: The shitheads that barely skirt following the rules. They make new ideas hard to go for. Because they want to suck the fun out of everything that isn't their take on Warcraft.

A lot of the problems of roleplay come from antagonistic people that tell you not to do something. If you have an idea you like, and there are people interested in roleplaying it, then do it. You don't need to consider critics once you've fulfilled those two criteria.

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you do.


Though I know that I had, once upon a time, made a statement on the subject matter, I do not wholly remember what it was that I had said regarding this particular issue; however, however! Whatever it was that I may have said in regards to it(the current topic of discussion, I mean.), I know that I stand by my aforementioned statement, without a shadow of doubt, what I said is what I meant and what I am standing by now. Whatever that may have been.

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6 minutes ago, Classic said:

you do.

<3

nooo, it's the cool people on this server! like u!

Edited by Avalia

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Sorry in advance as this contains anecdotal information. 

Most of these things happened between guilds. I can recall from Divinity a guild called Darkshire, who was basically just that - Darkshire, and another guild that was located near their premises: the Order of Mysteries. There were events that were made in which players from both of these guilds worked together to achieve an end goal. It worked pretty well for a time. If you're expecting a massive overhaul that players MUST abide by, it won't happen. Those initiatives never work. Instead, try testing the waters and if players enjoy it, great! It could blossom into something wonderful.

At the end of the day, players will go where their friends are, and wherever the rp is at.

  

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The most important thing about being a 'Good' roleplaying server is, like you said in one of the points above, going to be the community. The reason that a lot of RP servers don't have traction is either because of drama between people or the fact that the toxicity gets so bad that the server loses a lot of grasp on itself. There are, of course, major reasons such as not having active phases, the tech to the server not being well crafted, and plenty of others, but in the end, I feel like it's those two things.

 When you have people running around being assholes, memeing, and shitting on people just for doing whatever they want in their own, personal RP storylines, they're going to cause people to run off, tell their friends, and build a reputation for the community and server.

This is going to be the admins job, however, enforcing rules and everyone's own personal means to being a better person overall. It's hard to ask this, considering we live in an age of internet anonymity and people enjoy getting reactions from people, but I feel if this is monitored, it would be much, much better of a RP server than those out there. I've been on five different ones so far, and usually that's what I see happen to them. The community turns to crap, the admins don't do anything about it, and people begin to drift away because there isn't much of a reason to stick around. This is from my personal experience, however. I'm not saying have a rule where someone that calls another a 'Trash Gnoll RPer' to the guy RPing a Gnoll should be banned, or also get the boot just by typing the words 'kys retard', but having warnings and means of combating people like this, or keeping them in check, will be wise. Hell, maybe even reward good behavior, lmao.

You can have your opinions of other RPers and what they RP, and it's not wrong to dislike someone elses opinions, lol. You just shouldn't be ruining their experience here by attacking them publicly and ruining their night. THAT is what will make the server crumble and be like the rest, really.

I, in my opinion, think that everything will follow with a well managed community. Of course there will be phase and people drama for RP, because people want a lot of things to go their way in RP, but that can be settled man to man... but the toxic people that come to the server in means of memeing, trolling, and bluntly shitting on others just because they can, with no action against them, will in the end hurt the RP server to be like the rest.

Whew, a little long-winded, but I got there.

That's my two copper, take it as you will! This server has been beyond awesome so far, and it looks like it's in the VERY right direction.

Edited by Asdflawl

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Two things that I think this server should work against: Lounging around the OoC area and people demanding RP.

I personally feel that the OoC area needs to be diminished; it should serve as the starting point where all new characters begin, but it shouldn't be a hangout spot for players. Hell, the server could just have new characters spawn in their proper starting locations throughout the map. People need to be encouraged to remain IC as much as possible, that when they log on they should consider which character they want to play out and then focus on trying to get something going. We have the capacity here to make phases, so we can all hang out in our own areas during any downtime. If there's no central area, people will be coerced into doing something, not waiting for someone to make something happen for them.

Which brings us to the people sitting around with their thumbs up their asses, shit talking to each other, referring to everything as being "autistic" and generally acting like a bunch of adolescent monkeys, whining that there's no RP and aren't willing to expend any effort into hosting an RP setting. I don't want to just sound vitriolic, but this is becoming a considerable issue. Last server I played, too many people just spent their time in the OoC area, talking nonsense and acting irritable because there was no RP going on, not willing to provide anything themselves.

Both of these issues feed each other and drags down the whole point of even hosting an RP server. It's really more of an insult to those who go out of their way to establish pvt servers in the first place so that we all have a fun place to come together and waste time playing pretend. It's a good thing I have no authority on this server, because I'd be swinging around the Banhammer left and right, just from all the toxic kids who act like little parasites.

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I personally feel that the OoC area needs to be diminished; it should serve as the starting point where all new characters begin, but it shouldn't be a hangout spot for players. 

I don't really know why this train of thought ever catches on. People will simply go elsewhere to discuss things in an OOC fashion. It builds a sense of community, and so far, Epsilon's starting area has proved to be a place that is mostly non-toxic and promotes healthy discussion. At least, when I'm online. Any time any server has instituted a "mall mute" or has gotten rid of their OOC area entirely, people simply went OOC in phases or other areas, creating a significantly worse "problem" in the form of echo chamber cliques.


 

 

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15 minutes ago, roundabout said:

 

 

I don't really know why this train of thought ever catches on. People will simply go elsewhere to discuss things in an OOC fashion. It builds a sense of community, and so far, Epsilon's starting area has proved to be a place that is mostly non-toxic and promotes healthy discussion. At least, when I'm online. Any time any server has instituted a "mall mute" or has gotten rid of their OOC area entirely, people simply went OOC in phases or other areas, creating a significantly worse "problem" in the form of echo chamber cliques.

You must find the magic hour to be online because it doesn't take long for the OoC spot to devolve into poor behavior. More often than not, it's just kids talking down to others, mocking TRP profiles of random people, spamming nonsensical visuals (often with obnoxious audio), and all the while demanding that someone host RP for them. Based on this server and others I've seen, it's clear that an OoC area is not effective in bringing together a community or providing a space for healthy conversation; if anything, that's what the server chat channel is for, and especially this forum site. An OoC area just becomes redundant and enables poor community behavior.

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My only problem with role play sometimes is when it comes down to public phases and role plays people usually end up rotating around one generic spot when the mass tend to be. Be it around a campfire in the middle of nowhere, or a tavern housing Demon hunters and otherworldly beings, a good 50% of the time people lack initiation or usually silently judge profiles for their quality (guilty of the latter myself), sometimes the quality of the public role play is so poor that I find myself favouring private Role play with a group of friends, which in my own personal opinion is usually  a lot better as I have gotten to know such people and understand how they RP.

On a less important note, public role play is usually consistent of (X)Elf here. The majority being Quel'dorei, which in my understanding aren't so widely spread even then the majority seem to be  N E U T R A L when the last remaining High elves would of most likely threw themselves in with the Alliance when Theramore got destroyed.... But hey the versatility of roleplaying a neutral character right? But I digress, I would love to see more variety in phases once Epsilon has finally kicked off fully (A distant dream I am aware).

The point of my rant is - Roleplay is very situational.

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I'm just going to have to disagree with you completely on that one, Fraenir. I'm online quite a bit, and the only thing I notice is the "obnoxious" spell spam, which is quite useful for me, since then I can steal those spells for later use. Never look at anything like it's a bad thing, try to treat it as an opportunity.

Not to mention it's simply easy to sit there and wait for something to come along. It's an overall good thing. Try to look at it from a different perspective and both appreciate the good already there, and try to force some positivism into others, rather than wish for its removal entirety. Sure, some usual suspects are sure never to change, but short of bullying Mith, which seems to be a server pass-time, I've never seen anyone outwardly decrying profiles.


 

 

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2 minutes ago, roundabout said:

Sure, some usual suspects are sure never to change, but short of bullying Mith, which seems to be a server pass-time, I've never seen anyone outwardly decrying profiles.

Ehhh... I agree with everything you say besides this last part. There have been plenty of cases of people kinda' crapping on others beyond a playful manner. Teasing/bullying people for "LOL DRAGON EW KILL IT!" in a bluntly hazing manner is-... acceptable. But quite literally standing there, typing a full para/few sentences of how your profile is shit, your writing style is shit, and your entire existence on this server should be deleted cuz' of what you're rping is where action should be easily taken to a harder offense.

Saying that the 'usual suspects' will never change [Those subjects being the people that DO sit there and shit on your TRP/profile looking to make fun of you and get a angry reaction] isn't acceptable IMO. If you're going to be a idiot that shits on everyone profile bluntly in means to hurt them/piss them off as memes and wanting a reaction, you should easily be accounted for.

I've seen it happen in the start a few times, honestly, so it's already a thing the server is dealing with. Thankfully very little, but it still is happening. 

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I agree, strongly.


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I can tell this is a subject you're very passionate about, Avalia!

I appreciate where you are coming from with your points. The community has a responsibility to set the quality of the server. We will be a little better or maybe not quite as good depending on how the players treat one another.

The sorts of issues you mentioned with role-play ultimately take care of themselves. Community sponsored events have been successful historically speaking (Wyrmrest Accord had Kor'kron trials in 5.4 and currently the Tournament of Ages is ongoing on retail) so long as they aren't "server sponsored." The real focus must be on a family friendly environment. Show players why they would want to make their home here. Think, "Epsilon is Ohana." (:

Edited by Witch

Epsilon_Ohana.png

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I've had mostly zero luck finding people who are open to RPing outside of their clique to be honest. Maybe I'm just not on at the right time, but so far it feels like just more of the same. Also, I was told last night by a specific guild that they were "exclusive" and most spots were reserved. This does not do well in generating a friendly, positive, nor welcoming environment. I really want to like this server, but so far the openness of outsiders seems to be very far and few between . .

Edited by Enigma

kC6Aj06.gif?1Characters

  • Kraald Skullflare - Chaos Orc Pyremaster
  • Aellonora - Draenei Justicar
  • Solomon Zaine - Undead Lightslayer
  • Abel Caine Scarlet Chaplain
  • Agrail Eaglebrace - Highmountain Tauren Shaman

Probably more to come.

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1 hour ago, Chef said:

I've had mostly zero luck finding people who are open to RPing outside of their clique to be honest. Maybe I'm just not on at the right time, but so far it feels like just more of the same. Also, I was told last night by a specific guild that they were "exclusive" and most spots were reserved. This does not do well in generating a friendly, positive, nor welcoming environment. I really want to like this server, but so far the openness of outsiders seems to be very far and few between . .

There are always people that feel more comfortable playing with the people they know and trust. Aside from those, others are usually pretty friendly. It might take some time if you don't really know anyone, but if you just ask. I'm sure you'll have a good time :)

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1 hour ago, Chef said:

I've had mostly zero luck finding people who are open to RPing outside of their clique to be honest. Maybe I'm just not on at the right time, but so far it feels like just more of the same. Also, I was told last night by a specific guild that they were "exclusive" and most spots were reserved. This does not do well in generating a friendly, positive, nor welcoming environment. I really want to like this server, but so far the openness of outsiders seems to be very far and few between . .

I am sorry to hear that. I'm RPing right now with some friends in Azsuna if you'd like to bump into us!

Edited by Avalia

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